November 10, 2011
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What’s up with women and holding doors?
When we first moved to Staten Island, Mrs. jigg has often complained to me that people rarely hold the doors for her–especially at the ferry station which has heavy exit doors. I thought that was preposterous since I almost never experience it. People hold doors for me and I hold the doors for the people behind me. We began to pay extra close attention to her exiting, just to see what happens.
The first couple of times, I kept on saying, “See, the door was held for you!” further proving that I was right and New Yorkers are not as rude as people say we are. And of course, came the very first time that the door wasn’t held and it swung back in force. I felt her eyes dart back to me, making sure I had witnessed this lack of common courtesy. There are always exceptions of course and I knew that every now and then, there are bitches and douchebags who just don’t have a care about the people around them. I was sure the vast majority were people that weren’t like that and my wife was just remembering the actions of the few.
For the past three months, I have been mentally noting who has held the door and who hasn’t. After the first month, we both noticed men would hold the door almost all the time, regardless of race, age, or apparent social class. Women on the otherhand were the culprits and interestingly enough, usually white of the middle class or black of the working class. Age plays a significant role too as young women (30′s and below) were extremely likely to hold doors while older women were very likely to NOT hold the doors. Even this morning as I was typing up this post on my phone, the women in front of Mrs. jigg did not hold the door as she exited, resulting in the door swinging back.
Most of the culprits would just zoom through doors, sticking out their hand just long enough to keep the door open for themselves and then continue on their way without looking back. What’s even more interesting is that even if doors were often held for them, they felt no obligation to pay such a courtesy forward to the next person. Mrs. jigg entertained the idea that maybe this was just how people were from Staten Island. However, she also noted that almost all the women in her building at work (on Park Ave), do not hold doors as well.
In hindsight, I wished I had documented the amount of times I witnessed these things so that I would have actual stats. Mrs. jigg even suggested that she might just want to sit down and observe this behavior one day and try to document this. While it’s a strange idea because we’re not sociologists or anything, it’s interesting to see such a clear divide in gender and age.
Any idea as to why older women are less likely to hold doors?
Comments (29)
That would be an interesting experiment to run. Now you got me thinking. I can’t recall too many instances where someone blatantly doesn’t hold the door for me around here, although I am in VA.
Haha, what a social experiment. I thought you were going to talk about how some women get offended by chivalry or something… but this is definitely more interesting. I hold the doors whenever I can… sometimes I admit I forget, but I usually do. I also always thanks the person who holds one open for me.
they come from a time when chivalry ran rampant.
I’m not sure. If I ever hear or feel someone behind me, I always make an effort to hold doors. If I see elderly people or even just people in their 50′s approaching a door I’m going into, either in the same or opposite direction, I will hold the door for them and go behind them. My pet peeve is when I do that and tons of other people go in, like I’m some sort of bellhop. Frack off.
But yeah, I’m 25, white middle-class female, and I always hold doors.
In Hong Kong, people never hold doors for the person behind them. I think I get a door held for me maybe once a month, if I’m lucky. (Not including when I’m walking with friends of coworkers.) Most people just dash through the opening as quickly as they can, without a second thought about the person behind them.
So in comparison, New Yorkers are polite!
@miss_prettyinpink - lol. I know. I lived in a couple of years back and NOT ONE PERSON has ever held the door for me.
-ray leeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
@miss_prettyinpink - @jigg - in Korea, too! They will open the door and then SHUT IT behind them in your face! So rude…
The older generation women were just spoiled, I think so expect doors to be open for them but not the other way around
Maybe it’s too heavy for them to hold it. Or maybe they’re just a bunch of self absorbed assholes.
I mean, I get it. I’ve had those feelings too.
How come nobody holds the door for anybody, or at least it out further so that it doesn’t slam in my face?
UNTIL one night I was coming home and the door slammed behind me. I didn’t know that there was anybody that close behind me. It slammed in her face and she looked up from her phone and swore like it was my fault. In my head though, I was thinking, excuse me? You were on the phone,
obviously
not paying attention to where you’re walking or where the door might be and you’re pissed that I couldn’t hold the door for you as you walked through? Are you kidding me? No. RUDE.
As commuters, we should be ready to react appropriately to all sorts of forces not excluding doors, abrupt stopping of other commuters, huge crowds that have amassed by stairs leading out of the stations, etc. If you think somebody won’t hold the door for you, either speed up so you can push the door open yourself without it getting slamming in your face, or slow down and wait for the door to slam and then push it open.
I’ve found myself more concerned with people who can’t find their metrocard or don’t have it ready when they’re standing at the turnstyles. OR the commuters who have 20 metrocards in hand and they swipe all of them through to see if it’ll allow them to go through. In the middle of rush hour, at Grand Central. Death. Urgh. This totally turned into a rant. My bad.
Interesting you say this. In Texas, we drive more often than we take public transportation. But with the same category of people that you’ve noted, do not allow people to pass them up when changing lanes on road. They are the ones that would speed up when they see that you are trying to change lanes. There has to be a psychological reason for this!
Never trust a woman to do a man’s job.
I have also noticed this. I always hold the door for others because I would appreciate it in return. And I always thank the person whom holds a door open for me, yet I’ve noticed that some people don’t even acknowledge me when I hold the door open for them. Those people are just downright rude.
As for older white women – I agree with many of the people’s comments that they weren’t raised in an era that they had to hold doors open for other people so they just don’t do it.
my theory: they’re bitches. nah jk. seriously, every mom/dad teaches their son to hold doors for ladies, but probably don’t say much about door manners for their daughters. some of those daughters pick it up or don’t.
Doors are heavy, yo.
Interesting social experiment. And as for why older white women (and I refer to the age group between 45-60, not the elderly) don’t hold the door as much is, well– I might get flak for saying this, but I feel they believe they are self-entitled. I could be wrong perhaps but I work in retail and noticed these behaviours from time to time and it’s not just about simply holding the door.
Oh man.
Every single “fight” (argument) I’ve ever had on the Subway or at work over decorum-related matters was with a middle age woman. Seriously, it’s always some fat ugly cow that tries to pick a fight with me
I don’t like holding doors and I absolutely hate it when people hold the door for me. You think I can’t open the door? And especially when they’re holding the door for me when I’m a mile away, then I have to run through the doors and thank them. I believe I am competent and capable enough to open a door for myself. I think the whole door holding thing is inconvenient for them and for me. I mean, I’ll hold the door if someone is right behind me, cause that’s just mean to not do. But in general, door holding is demeaning.
I’m a college student and I also noticed that if there’s ever the case someone does not hold open a door for me, it’s most likely a female. :
They’ve got places to be and they aint stopping for no one? I dunno, but door holding is an interesting one. More often that not when people hold the door open for me it’s in the awkward zone where I’d rather they didn’t.
@jigg - Hahaha yeah. When I first moved here I had to get used to the door almost slamming in my face every day.
@Mad_Wife - They shut it behind them? That’s so random hahah.
Older women probably don’t hold doors for others because they feel it’s too heavy. Or it’s a status issue.
I go to work carrying so many bags, and if I notice someone trailing behind me–where they can rush in a second and be right behind me–I would hold the door for them. Or if they have a push cart of those wheeled bags. (haha, cuz we’re teachers).
I haven’t thought about the people who wouldn’t hold the door for me, but most do anyway because I’m carrying so many things.
But if I enter a room and my students trail behind, I hold the door or ask the person behind me to hold the door.
they are feminists… i really wish that was a sarcastic comment but it isn’t. and for men it is one of the last dying things of gentlemanly conduct.
they were taught that everyone looks out for number one, and so they expect kindness and try to live that story. younger women and girls learned how heartless that is, and don’t use the same behavior. also there is a significant decline of young women’s membership within organizations like NOW. the ladies of my generation have noticed how 0 parent households due to one or both parents being employed out of the household changes the support children experience, and where former generations would say they were proud of the economic accomplishment for equality. girls now know that the new norm reduces freedoms rather than granting more….
and all the social behavior circles back on what social values they perceive. the harder the ‘go getter’ attitude is ingrained, the more they feel the need to rush and accomplish, and the more stress from that attitude. as stress builds up urgency does to in a desperate attempt to relieve the stress, and most unfortunately the eternal rush becomes habitual to the extent that schedules start to matter.
egos become built up and dependent on that delivery of product but as determination to advance builds and one gets higher in the hierarchy and further away for the actual product they have to deliver. it doesn’t help that many seem to genuinely believe they are representing a repressed minority and have to overcompensate.
… it is all shit, but if you are the ‘majority repressing’ them (even implicitly, without personal action, like feminism claims) helping you is against their own interests. and if you are also a woman struggling with the same struggles, then helping you is ‘trivializing the struggle’ or something… i forget the exact words, but it was totally sociopathic and self-defeating if you think about what causes success/profit in business.
oh well, with the next generation of women the world will hopefully be improved beyond these trivial but antisocial actions.
This pisses me off. Where I live, the only people who are holding doors are senior men, and probably one in ten of 40 year old gentlemen. Occasionally, a younger man in his 30′s or late 20′s. Women, very rarely. And it’s definitely not because I am hideous and scare people. I am a young attractive women and I smile a lot. I always hold the door for others. I refuse to become one of them.
This reminds me of a book a read, relating to the story of a good Samaritan. In short, they pretended to be a person who was in a semi-busy street and watched to see who would stop to help. I think it was a psychology study to determine the causes of why people chose to help others. They expected it was education or culture that caused the differences but it turned out to be a very simple fact. They found that the only reason people didn’t help others was the simple fact that they were in a rush to do something or get somewhere. They found that people often skipped over rather extreme pleas for help because they simply had to be somehwere: job, interview, date, etc.
I think this study applies to why people don’t hold doors either. Though I think gender might have an impact as well – ex) younger people and usually men more likely to hold doors because they’re stronger and part of culture (young help old) – (men help women)
This is funny. Back when I was growing up not too too long ago, in the 60′s. I was such a “feminist.” Rebelling things I knew nothing about. In my late twenties, I dated a guy who insisted that when we were walking, he walked on the edge of the walk closest to the street and would always guide me to the inside as we turned or changed directions. He told me that back in the days of the horse and carriage, men who respected their women didn’t want them to get dirty when horses drove by so they walked away from the edge of the roads. And that in the tradition of respect, his father taught him to always do this for the ladies in his life. He insisted that I waited for him to open the door of the car before I entered or exited. The same when passing through doors. It is rare to find gentlemen who know these social norms of years past. Rarer still are those who remember why. I never assume that someone will hold the door for me, but am always impressed by a young man who still does. I think to myself that someone taught him well.
Ladies who have men that do this for them from my generation are those who forget to hold them for others as you have described. They are just spoiled. Or rude. And then again, I will hold the door if I think it will swing back at someone behind me.
Write more when you complete this experiment. It will be interesting read.
i live in manhattan. Since there’s so many transplants here, maybe the problem is not as bad. My pet peeve is not with women and door holding, but rather, when you make a big effort to hold the door open and the other person doesn’t say Thank you.
often times i personally could only hold the heavy doors long enough to barely pass thr the door myself (esp the heavy glass doors against the gusty wind). often times the people behind me have to hold it for me so that i can pass through. maybe that’s one reason why women don’t hold (heavy) doors as often as guys do.
I Just moved to Aspen Colorado, lots of spoiled people, and I googled this subject because I have noticed this phenomenon for some time now. Perhaps the anecdote is exacerbated do to my current environment. To be clear, I was raised in the south, I was taught to open doors for others, all people, not just women. Today I opened a door for a woman at the bank sporting 3 children, no acknowledgment, perhaps they thought I was a hired doorman.It got me thinking and I can’t remember the last time a female of any age held the door foe me, sadly that includes my wife. Then again I always make it a habit to beat her to the door so that I can be a gentleman. Moreover, when a gentleman opens the door for their sweetheart, the female inevitably has first choice of seating in the restaurant. Thus, I rarely get to face the window, only the wall. Question, guys, why do we follow these antiquated/unrequited rules?
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